Graphilosophy: Exploring how our views on life shape our graff

[4menace2society0]

what the fuck is this thread
scipl you sound like a clown
matter fact you sound like a damn snitch

[junkbox]

the majority of the world agrees..

don't mean to directly bust on you but, the majority of the world is well... in my opinion, not always a humble one, most of if not all the people that have made a difference in the world and/or done something of significance, be it artistic, scientific/technological, philosophical; whatever---they were, by their very nature, not of the majority...

I was thinking today, the biblical idea of original sin, I don't necessarily believe everyone is born fallen from grace and needs to repent in order to be that camel that fits through the eye of the needle, no.. but it occurred to me that its easier for man, mankind, to be evil, do wrong, wickedness is the default ( take a look at history if you don't agree [shit, maybe this is only, overall, caucasians, no joke] ). one has to work hard to rid themselves of the negative/"evil"...

Today I see two different writers.. illegal and legal writers.. As I mentioned above, illegal writers have reasons they do what they do, and I thought about it and shared my views above, and also legal writers have reasons they do what they do.... I think it's Daim over in Europe who sticks to legals, he mentions in a video how unreasonable it is now to paint illegally, well, Daim's ideas/philosophy is his, if you don't like it, ok, but respect it.. the guy can paint..

I think you can take any dichotomy and make a case for dividing writers along those lines. you've had writers who consider their work art, and those that say 'FUCK ART' [ although I do feel a skilled writers work is art whether he/she likes it or not ;D ]. got writers who live hip-hop and those that could care less about hip-hop. writers who strictly bomb, want to smash shit, more more more!! verses writers who want to perfect their style, and shit, everything in between.

we could even divide writers among stylistic lines, three dimensional (Daim made me think of this) vs. 'traditional', abstract vs. wildstyle... I realize that black & white thinking is well, not so great, even without color theres always going to be nearly infinite shades of grey... I wonder what old Daim or any of those super-fresh western european style kings would have to say?

(signature here)

that quote in your signature, is that about the dude with the quad-barrel derringer in his thread? doubt you'd find an average street thug with one of those, I mean they look cool, but its my understanding the bullets actually spread out.. from 1-2 ft. away I'd assume getting shot with one of those would cause serious damage, but if you shot at a dude, I dont know, 30 ft. away, it seems they might actually travel out & around him... if guns are ones thing, I say 'dont talk about it be, about it'


{might make more sense to reply to a post in the proper order, after its been made, but since I was editing mine anyway thought I'd respond here as a sort of correction, and skip making what may be an unnecessary post}

where is ribcage?

I'll assume, without checking, that ribcage is that dude with the gun in his sig. For all know he's the realest thug motherfucker around, and does indeed own & carry the firearm in his signature (this could go for whoevers signature its in, if not ribcage, and anyone who posts pictures of guns actually). I'd say what I was trying to do there was agree with 4menace2society0 on something after responding rather negatively to his post, balance things out ya know? not bash on any person specifically who appears to be into guns and lets us know.

i have, in my days on the internet, seen a lot of people I didn't particularly care for post pictures of guns, and definitely more than a few were just trying to look tough on the internet with a relatives probably legally owned handgun.

Whatever the case, from what I read now (and should've done before posting, sorry), the gun pictured is a COP .357, and fires each bullet seperately, so really that whole part of my post was wrong (although I also discovered that sometimes it will fire more than one bullet at once, sort of accidentally). Seems there were and still are multi-barrel weapons that purposely fire all bullets at once to cause more damage, at close range I'd think. In any case, if it is you ribcage and you really do own of these, I'd be interested to hear more about it, either here (perhaps with your thoughts on how ethics apply to carrying and using firearms, gun control, whatever), or via PM. It looks nice for sure.

As for 'if guns are ones thing.."don't talk about it be about it"', really I think this world needs less weapons, murder, but I suppose you wouldn't want someone to beat you to that, I can see if other folks are going to be about it, you might want to too.


NOTE: I took quite a few parts out of my post here, wasn't happy with it overall, I thought of removing the whole thing but, I didn't. I think the proper thing though is note what I've done (Removed part of response to scipl, removed direct response to 4menace2society0; I was actually most troubled by my words on guns, both first and second, but I've left 'cause I think they're at least somewhat significant). Also, 2 things.. 1) I don't know who the fuck ribcage is/was, but my second thing about guns still stands, in correction of the first. 2) I talked to a friend this morning about his guns, and why he has guns in general. Aside from being a fan of them in general, he sees it as preparation for some possible apocalypse, martial law, whatever. I'd guess the same, in a sense, holds true of folks on city streets, if other people, cops/gov. included, might come at you with firearms, it make sense to be prepared.

[deathorglory]

where is ribcage?

[scipl]

it was all "worthless"?? me no understand... did you expect to get something out of it besides the joy of painting?

For me, I enjoyed getting up on whatever I wanted, but after a couple years, it became bland and worthless to me, I was just promoting me and my name and my crew, and it wasn't helping anyone.. and it put me at risk..(one in my crew got arrested in like 2006). It just stopped adding up to me like it has for a lot of writers, I wanted more than to just feel the same feeling over and over, I wanted to do something new with it, maybe something that helped someone else.. I realized that either way I would be painting, so I would still enjoy it... I can get joy out of lots of things other than taking the risks I was taking.. so I ventured out, I'm meeting new and different people, experiencing who they are and how they view writing, and most of all I'm looking to promote ideas that help others in this life and doing so has been new every time, It feels worth my while, it's even more enjoyable than before... but hey, this is just me, I'm not asking nobody to tell me what they think of me, honestly I don't care what you think, this thread is open to sharing ideas that you have about me or anyone else sharing ideas in here, but it's not open to sh*t-talk, because sh*t-talk gets us nowhere and doesn't explain an idea.. i liked your question Tony..

sci

[skinaone]

what the fuck is this thread
scipl you sound like a clown
matter fact you sound like a damn snitch

this

[scipl]

what the fuck is this thread
scipl you sound like a clown
matter fact you sound like a damn snitch

I don't care, this thread is what it is, read.. don't complain.. Snitches love causing problems for other people by opening their mouths about other peoples business, I don't cause problems for other people, period.. self-control is good-stuff.. I still know many writers who are into illegal work, it's their business not mine, I'm about legals and they respect that, keep your drama to your self.. this thread is for sharing our deeper thoughts and that's what I did.. if you think I'm a snitch then you just gotta bad interpretation.. I invite you to share your world-view and how your painting works into it.. share or leave..

[skinaone]

[scipl]

share or leave

[skinaone]

or mods can delete this thread

["MONSTER"]

first off im not tryin to dis you im simply stating my opinion.

if getting up illegaly got boring for u it might have been because you wer treating graff as a hobby or to prove to yourself that u could dot or maybe even to be cool if u are an artist i can respect that but you cant call yourself a writer if you criticize the toys for tryin to learn the ropes by getting up sure i think theres plenty of people hwo should practice before they even lay their hands on a can but the best way for them to start is to jumo in to the streets head first in the words of day day from next friday "players fuck up" remember where graffiti started in the streets and if u ask me cornbread didnt hav much of a stylized hand it simply said cornbread and with that he showed the world who he was and what he stood for. people get into grafftiti for alot of reasons and they also leave graffiti for a lot of reasons but wether you are active or not never look down on those who are in the same position you were a few years back.

again not tryin to talk shit just putin it out there

[scipl]

first off im not tryin to dis you im simply stating my opinion.

if getting up illegaly got boring for u it might have been because you wer treating graff as a hobby or to prove to yourself that u could dot or maybe even to be cool if u are an artist i can respect that but you cant call yourself a writer if you criticize the toys for tryin to learn the ropes by getting up sure i think theres plenty of people hwo should practice before they even lay their hands on a can but the best way for them to start is to jumo in to the streets head first in the words of day day from next friday "players fuck up" remember where graffiti started in the streets and if u ask me cornbread didnt hav much of a stylized hand it simply said cornbread and with that he showed the world who he was and what he stood for. people get into grafftiti for alot of reasons and they also leave graffiti for a lot of reasons but wether you are active or not never look down on those who are in the same position you were a few years back.

again not tryin to talk shit just putin it out there

hey good point, personally I think toys can learn the ropes legally, I currently teach a workshop at a local skatepark where I do exactly this.. we can bomb the wall, tag it, piece it, etc., plenty of space to practice and learn the ropes. Thanks for mentioning Cornbread, you made a good point, there's a lot of reasons we do what we do, I mean if we stepped up to Cornbread right now and asked him why he did it, what would he say? I'm realizing that writers change over the years in many cases, why they write changes. I don't know why ya think I'm looking down on anyone who still paints illegally, It's just not for me for the reasons I shared, it doesn't mean I look down on those hitting up the city all over, I treat them as I'd like to be treated, bottom-line.. real-talk. And ya, thanks for stating your opinion and sharing your thoughts and not crapping out your as* in here.. respect.

[MN Nice]

[so happy together]

Where did the letter structure go? Graff is like music now. it doesnt matter what it says aslong as it sounds/looks good. you dont have to have letters down packed anymore u can buy some fat caps do some flashy flares n ur the shit now. fuck that.

[scipl]

Where did the letter structure go? Graff is like music now. it doesnt matter what it says aslong as it sounds/looks good. you dont have to have letters down packed anymore u can buy some fat caps do some flashy flares n ur the shit now. fuck that.

Well.. honestly, graff is what you make it, that's what it is. You can understand what I make out of it from reading my posts above. At the end of the day it's a design of some sort, and most designs are called art, and all art expresses something. If the artist doesn't have letters down and sprays some flashy flares then that's what they want to express. If someone has amazing extensions, flow, balance, 3D, etc. when they piece then that's what they want to express, and that's fine by me as long as it doesn't screw someone else over in the process. ALSO, flashy flares are cool, maybe they're popular right now because writers are pushing them to their limits and expressing tag styles differently than ever before with them. For me, a tag with flashy flares belongs next to a nice piece, a piece that expresses something helpful for others to view, think about, and take something worthwhile from. If the tag with flashy flares helps express what the piece is expressing or expands on the theme of the piece then that's great, but a tag alone just isn't worthwhile in my opinion... then again, this thread is ALL about sharing our personal opinions and learning how we all handle graff differently.. so there's my view, thanks for sharing your view in here, was good to read your raw feelings in word form..

[scipl]

If someone were to put my views on what spray-paint art should be, what it should express, and how it should be carried out by those of us who have the skills to paint, then, this sites (http://wall-therapy.com/about-wall-therapy/) videos would express my ideas visually... the "BELIEVE" & "Visual Intervention" projects are my views on painting manifested. Again, this thread is for sharing your view(s) on life and how they shape your present day painting- whether that be illegal/legal painting- share how you feel about painting on the wall and why you feel the way you do.. for me the videos sum it up... "inspiration," everyone needs it, and through spray-paint art I can give it.. yeah, I understand in my view that it's all about "giving"..

[Theartofverb]

The idea of "getting up" is ruining graff. People are sacrificing quality for quantity. As an writer I'm trying to make people think or smile or just say "shit, that's cool" instead of just putting my name on a wall to mark territory. I love the idea of giving art to people that might have never seen or really care about it

[GuyGuyer of Guyland]

Well.. I don't go to community college... and I already bombed illegally for 3 years, I was up with different names all over the place, down highways, on billboards, and for me it was all worthless painting. I didn't post what I posted in this thread for you to slam me with some dumb response that makes fun of me... doing that is just as worthless as I've found the illegal scene to be.. I posted in this thread so you could "respond" to it, if you don't care then don't post, I'm not asking nobody to approve or disapprove my actions, I've decided what I wanna do and it's because I've thought about it, I'm asking you what your world-view is and how you think it shapes your painting, I was the last person who was too pussy to get up, and I still am, I choose to not get up illegally for reasons that I've expressed, so don't come in here talking some damn non-sense that doesn't even belong here, you waste everyone's time including yours..

The illegal scene you find useless is the reason legal graffiti exists. If it were not for the chicken scratch or in your face throws then no one would want to look at stylized lettering. No one wants change, but if it is forced upon you with illegal graffiti then time invested legal work is much more appealing now isn't it? Don't hate the writers who paint illegally, we're stubborn and arrogant, but we paved the way for you to come in and set your ideologies on what is acceptable and what isn't.

Any life defining choice you make will shape your perspective of the world and thus will change your philosophy on life, graffiti is no different.

[GuyGuyer of Guyland]

------------continued---------

The following is the world-view I discovered and settled on while painting both illegally and legally in life over the past 8 years. I have taken time to sit down and ask myself questions and examine what I'm doing and from this I've
developed a kind of philosophy or graphilosophy (random word I thought of.. ) … a title for this info randomly popped into my head "My graphilosophy says grafflicitly" hope others will share their ideas too, because human ideas are extremely fun to explore….

---------------------

Illegal Writers…

1) You have to deal with pressure because ppl are gonna hate on you just because of what you do:
police, regular citizens, etc.

2) You risk loosing your clean record, which can effect multiple things..

3) You risk surrendering your time usage while alive on earth to hours of community service: you
can't hang with your friends as much, you can't do what you want to do, you have to clean or things
just get worst… although, cleaning up the community isn't bad punishment, it's nice when things are
clean.. still, your time is precious and you risk handing it away to service hours which can hurt you
if your time is most usefully spent doing other things…

4) You risk missing out on tons of friendships that you could build just by asking the owners of
places, "Can I paint on the bare wall of your building?"

5) You risk having to cover up your own work immediately after you just got caught for doing it..

6) You risk wasting your time painting to promote you and some mysterious movement when you
could be enjoying your fellow citizens and getting to know them by asking for permission and
learning how they view spray art and it's place in society.. ultimately you struggle when speaking to just anybody and
you assume that everybody is connected to the cops and trying to get you arrested, so you risk
enjoying regular interaction with other people around you where you may have a chance to do
work on their building or help them understand spray art if they have a twisted/ignorant view of it.

7) You risk never getting paid for your hard work

8) You risk your safety when you're running from police in certain environments

9) You risk your safety when you're trespassing and have no clue what the real hazards are in the
environment you've entered

10) You risk teaching others a lifestyle that could expose them to unnecessary pain or even death
because of the risks you take and lead others to take

11) You risk making people really upset and having to deal with their retaliations to your illegal work, retaliations that could expose you to unnecessary pain or even death

12) You risk making someone angry and having to deal with their anger towards you for your entire
life on earth (although this could happen in any circumstance, why let your choice to paint illegally increase the possibilities??)

13) You risk getting fined a large amount of money that you will have to find a job to pay off, a job you may not like that will take up time that you could be spending differently

14) You risk missing out on opportunities to make money by doing spray art work for local building owners, because instead you spend time carefully planning illegal work..

Legal Writers…

1) You don't have any added pressure because you paint your name in broad day light. People may still give you an attitude but you
can be completely open and honest with them because you aren't hitting random stuff on the streets: police respect you (hopefully), and regular citizens have an
opportunity to respect you, plus painting with your friends in the day light gets more of a return for your effort, you don't have to waste so much time planning
illegal work because you're not breaking any rules..

2) You never risk loosing a clean record, a clean record can have many benefits..

3) You aren't forced to give your time on earth over to community service because you will never get caught for breaking rules, You won't find yourself painting over all
your hard work with white paint the same day you finished working on it..

4) You have endless opportunities all over the place to meet new people who own buildings and learn about their view on spray art and if they'd like to incorporate it on their
building(s).

5) You don't become a stuck-up and weird stand-offish human who's full of themselves and never taking the initiative to pursue variety and ultimately enjoy life for what
it's worth, you don't live in fear of the police and what they may do to you, you don't live scared of anyone who isn't in your crew or a crew you know of because you paint legally
you have none of these cares.. in addition to this you're not wasting your time and getting confused trying to promote your crew all over town or some mysterious
movement that doesn't seem to be going anywhere fast.. you just promote art as an entertaining medium to view, and build relationships through your art with local
citizens; using your art talent to help others enjoy life.. so then you don't have an ignorant and narrow view on everything outside of writing, you are well rounded and
everyone who's not being dumb can enjoy who you are by the way you express yourself..

6) Because you're known for legal spray paint art you are able to spend more time looking for art-related projects, you don't have to spend time planning illegal work,
instead you can ride around and pick up projects at local cafe's etc. where you can be open and true about what you do and who you are..

7) You don't have to risk what may happen when running from the police because you will have no police after you

8) You don't have to risk what may happen when you trespass because your painting environments are found on active territory (hopefully free of hazards!)

9) You aren't teaching others a lifestyle of vandalism you're teaching them a lifestyle of painting to express yourself to others for the benefit of getting to know others
and enjoying such interaction, what you teach you won't have to feel guilty about later or wish you hadn't taught, no regrets..

10) You won't make local citizens upset because you decided with them what you will paint on their building and that is all that matters, people will find respect for you (hopefully), so you
won't deal with ridiculous and unknown retaliations on such a grand scale by doing illegal work only

11) People won't be angry with you in places where you're caught painting on their entities, since you always ask permission what you do is expected to be on other peoples
entities, they have nothing to be angry about.. unless you paint a huge penis instead of what you agreed to paint!

12) You won't have to pay your hard earned cash to the government for working hard on an illegal piece that you were caught painting because your work is legal and getting fined is
not even a care

13) Since you won't get caught you get to build and strengthen your resume in your local sphere, the more projects you complete the better known you become, the better
your portfolio looks the greater a desire people will have for what you have to offer, the opportunities that stack up are great as compared to what's missed by being out and
writing the same-old-same-old and getting the same-old reactions your whole life..

My personal Exceptions to illegal writing:

1) Concerning the mysterious movement behind spray paint art in general, I know they're some illegal artists out there who swear that what they write illegally will be noticed,
and after it gets noticed it will some how send off sparks in the minds of the powers that be, and in turn because they painted their illegal work they have in turn changed
the minds of the powers that be and in turn changed how we're governed in america.. In… This…. Case… I actually think that illegal graffiti is needed if someone really thinks
that their work can do this, because I totally hate the choices that our government makes in this country on all sorts of levels and I wanna see SO much change, especially
how money is used… (this is a whole different discussion, "Can an abundance of illegal graff cause anything to change?")

2) If illegal work saves someones life, I have No… Clue… how this would come about, but if painting an illegal work at the right time and the right place is to save someone
from suffering an unnecessary death, then so be it, I know there's such thing as art therapy… If your illegal work helps someone heal from cancer then go for it..

3) Moments of Injustice or other things you're getting affected by: Again, I have No.. Clue… how this would come about, but if painting illegally would some how resolve unjust
actions that are being done against you or resolve an evil agenda that's being forced on you then by all means take the chance of getting caught and paying a fine or whatever
in order to put an end to injustice or evil agendas that are plaguing you or others..

Jesus fuck I want to punch you for writing this ignorant bullshit. You're being a presumptuous cunt with all of these "you risk" assumptions.

Did you know you risk pain or death when you get in your car to drive to work in the morning? Well, I guess if you don't drive like an idiot then it's likely you won't face that risk. The same goes for painting.

Your legal painting won't cure cancer, your illegal painting for cause it. Jesus christ I cannot believe how much of an idiot you're making yourself look like.

[GuyGuyer of Guyland]

The idea of "getting up" is ruining graff. People are sacrificing quality for quantity. As an writer I'm trying to make people think or smile or just say "shit, that's cool" instead of just putting my name on a wall to mark territory. I love the idea of giving art to people that might have never seen or really care about it

What one person thinks as cool another may not. Your "cool" artwork may seem stupid as fuck to another while another writers tag may be awesome to the next dude.

[GuyGuyer of Guyland]

or mods can delete this thread

I've come to the same decision.