actually fifteen of the hijackers were from saudi arabia, two were from the united arab emirates, one was from egypt and one was from Lebanon.. not one was from afghanistan. the man who orchestrated and bank rolled the attack was a saudi who was based in afghanistan( osama bin laden). know your math before you spit out your "facts" son.
Woah woah woah. Guys cmon, dont be callin me an idiot and whatnot because of my veiws. Although I shouldve def clarified that I DONT agree with most of the war. All Im baseing it on is my 2 tours in Iraq and Afghanistan in the Corp. First of all, even if we did manage to kill/capture Osama (even a couple years ago) NOTHING would be differant right now, just like how nothing has changed since Sadams capture and ultimate execution. Are we using this war to better our country (in financial terms) yes we are and Ive seen it myself. I know I eluded to the fact that I think we should be over there for our own countries security and I do beleive that. Most of you guys dont realize that if we wernt over there, their wouldve been an estimated 450 DIFFERANT attacks (since 9/11) that wouldve plausibly played out here on our soil, not to mention the countless other attacks that COULD have happened (that were already planned and in motion) but arnt included in that figure because we (our military) deemed them to be unlikely or not having the neccasary backing in manpower, funds, materials, etc. I know of 6 LIKELY attacks that I along with my unit personally put a stop too. Not all of you, but alot of you just hear shit on the news or the radio or from friends that seems to make sense and automatically beleive it without personally looking into it or talking with the soldiers who were over there involved in it. Im not saying Im right, this is all what I think, but I beleive this way because of what Ive seen. My actual reason (new reason since I served and did my time) for agreeing with us being over there IS the liberation of that whole geographical area, beleive it or not, the regular (and vast majority) of people over there are extremely nice, nothing like the society we live in here. They just happen to be overrun with extremists, few in numbers but high in power. If we dont do anything about this situation now, it will only get so much worse. Maybe to the point where we could no longer do anything about it.
But see with Japan, we were fighting another government, not a bunch of extremists. Theres a HUGE differance.
I went a little overboard with the name calling I apologize for that. My beef isn't with the soldiers. A big concern for me is that by effectively "weeding out" the extremists we only create more by making martyrs of killed or captured enemies. I don't see how we can win hearts and minds and wage a war in their country at the same time. I think liberating these people from the extremists isn't a good excuse for being there. Why aren't we in Sudan? Yemen or Rwanda? The only reason that comes to mind is maybe its because there is no political gain/positioning to be had or maybe they haven't any natural resources to exploit... Millions of people are being oppressed by some form of extremism all over the world, and I think its pretty clear that liberating the people of Iraq and Afghanistan is just a pleasant little byproduct of what ultimately was a bullshit reason to go to war, something we can say to make ourselves feel a little better about everything we've lost and have yet to loose.
Once terrorism becomes affiliated with a countries' political party things get messy. As it did with Afghanistan and Iraq. So im right there with ya as far as military action goes, although we got a bit over our heads. Afghanistan should have been our priority.
Dont worry about it bro. Good point though. Yet it seems though that if you invade ANY country, whether to fight its government, its people, terrorists, oppresors, movements, etc. etc. you are bound too, in a sense, create more soldiers for the enemy, not just in this case. Im sure if the US was invaded many people on BS even, would rise up and fight against our attackers, including me. As far as those other countries you threw out, Sudan is VERY rich in oil, and other natural gasses, as well as has really fertile land (that with an irrigation system would grow phenomonally). Yemen is also rich in oil (although it is being depleted) and even more wealthy in its natural gas reserves. As for Rwanda, they too have very rich soil and produce and export alot of coffee and tea. They are now also used as a model for developing countries to follow. MANY companies HQ's reside there now, and many more make the move every year. Theres plenty of other countries we could have easily fabricated a story about and then invaded, many countries where it wouldve been easier and we would of had more to gain. Just my thoughts though.
I cannot remember who's quote this is, but this kind of bodes in the discussions favor, I think. "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself" America.. Fuck yeah.
Afghanistan is also in part, a war on drugs. A huge % of the world's heroin comes from there, grown by the people of the land who are controlled by the Taliban who use the money to finance whatever they need to fight in their various conflicts in Africa, Chechnya, Afghanistan etc. I really do think we should be in Afghanistan (would be contradictory if I didn't believe that, for reasons I will not mention) because in the grand scheme of things, fucking the Taliban/whatever people they are associated with on any front is a good thing, especially if in part it helps to restore a nation which was fucked up by the Russians when they had their own little Vietnam there. I don't condone the war in Iraq but after hearing from a few buddies of mine overseas there, it's pretty hilarious that America is slowly leaving it almost as fuck up as it was when they got there, the Iraqi army/police force is nowhere near suitable to hold their own country together, while they're probably not as bad as the ANA it's still a fucked up place for anyone, just as it was before they were there for the second time.
^Exactly, the US leaving any of these countries right now is a huge mistake, were going to be leaving it most likely in worse shape than before. (Due to the damage caused by the war, physically as in the condition of buildings, etc., the peoples mental status, and in some cases the local government.) But I do beleive if we stay that in time this could, and will, all be fixed.
WWII anybody? Or was invading germany a bad move? Fuck you shithead, liberal fuck. Perhaps we should have sent Eichmann and Hitler a coexist bumper sticker. Fuck off.